As far as the purpose of this site - the discussion of Agatha Christie's work, isn't it a bit late for that after you posted several messages in reply to my message(s)....if you thought this why didn't you say so sooner or simply not reply back to my messages.....
I'm not anti-Catholic nor am I pro-Catholic either. Nor have I stated anything that is factually inaccurate.
History is not irrelevant. If anything is quite fascinating when you read about it. In this case, most people (historians included) agree that had Henry the 8th offered the Pope Clement VII enough money he would have granted the annulment. However, the problem was Catherine of the Aragon, who happened to be the aunt of Charles V (Holy Roman Emperor) who was also Charles I of Spain (the riches and most powerful country at this time). In 1527 Charles sacked Rome and held the Pope prisoner. Given the situation there was no way the Pope would ever have given Henry his annulment for the simply reason he wasn't powerful enough. And there was no way Charles would have sided against his aunt. Now if you want to argue this point...go right ahead......I would be interested to know why you think I'm wrong. I might add this wasn't the first time a member of European royalty asked the pope for a marriage annulment. In 1152 Eleanor of Aquitaine asked for annulment from Louis VII of France and it was granted. Not long afterwards she married Henry II of England. I won't go into details. If you are interested you can read about why she did this, along with the possible reasons for the pope granting the annulment.
If you want to offer a rebuttal to some of the points I've made - okay, but let's leave the nitpicking with spelling and the accusations out of the conversation. I remember not long ago the Vatican bank in Italy was being investigated by the Italian government for money laundering. Apparently corruption and abuse of power is not isolated to the US. Now do you consider my statement about the money laundering anti-Catholic or am I just being factually inaccurate.....or perhaps it just one giant conspiracy in order to discredit the Catholic church.
Getting back to this being a platform for the works of Christie. It is also a platform for her life as well, which is exactly what I was doing when talking about her marriages. And if we do go off on tangents - big deal. That's life. It happens.
Agatha Christie wasn't Catholic, so your determination to drag Catholicism into your speculations about her marriages on a thread about the worst Poirot novel is not only irrelevant, it is trolling.
Start your own thread, then people who want to discuss the Catholic Church can join you and the rest can avoid you.
1) Yes, but Christie who was an Anglican did create a character, Hercule Poirot who was Catholic (it is also intersting to compare/contrast the differences between the Anglican and Catholic faiths and the impact they have on people's lives with a particular focus on marriage) 2) you don't have to respond to my messages and where I post them doesn't really matter (although I do try to keep on topic, discussions aren't and shouldn't be rigid to the point where you are walking on egg shells for fear of going off topic) - more importantly no one is forcing you to respond and 3) once again debate the points I've brought instead of dishing out the ad hominems and/or personal attacks.
I think five little pigs is excellent. Have to agree about the Hollow, I found it quite a drudge to get through and the whole feel of the book was laboured. I only read Sad Cypress last year but have no memory of it at all. That probably speaks for its self.
This will probably surprise a lot of you, “Sad Cypress,” was my least favorite. It was slow paced, and I could guess the murderer before the murder EVEN HAPPENED. There was little to no plot twists or moments that made me gasp. I was pointing out who the murderer was till the very end, and this was very disappointing.
It doesn't surprise me, although I read it more times that Murder in Mesopotamia, Murder On The Links, Peril At End House, The Mystery of The Blue Train, The Labours of Hercules amd Murder On The Orient Express, I have now taken it off my Reading list and designated it to the Category 'Not Again', I just got fed up with The Characters and Plot.
I think The Big Four is the worst Poirot novel. I am not fan of The Hollow, it doesn't seem a detective novel. The crime is not the main thing, it's just a way to write about others things. Sad Cypress would be a great book without Poirot. Besides, as @AndThenThereWasMax said, it's slow paced.
@tudes ;I for one quite liked The Big Four! :-) I thought The Hollow was *really* good in terms of characterizations - to me the murder seemed rather incidental! The Mystery of the Blue Train is another one that I really like. I don't think there are many like Katherine Grey! And while Sad Cypress with the murderer I guess being a bit obvious, I just LOVED the plot detailing. SPOILER - the morphine versus apomorphine and the rose tree without thorns was genius!
For me, the worst Poirot novel is easily Elephants Can Remember. Christie rambled a lot in Third Girl and in Halloween Party as well - overly long descriptive passages that really didn't add much value overall in my opinion. For that matter, having read and reread Christie multiple times over the years, I have come to the conclusion that out of her phenomenal body of work, there are only three true duds - Elephants Can Remember, Passenger to Frankfurt and Postern of Fate.
I have come to the conclusion that out of her phenomenal body of work, there are only three true duds - Elephants Can Remember, Passenger to Frankfurt and Postern of Fate.
How did you feel about Destination Unknown? I've attempted to read the book multiple times and while the beginning hooks me and peaks my interest, as I read further the story begins to falter a bit in terms of pacing. Maybe I need to just read it head on again. I might think differently.
Murder In Mesopotamia, It was slow and Boring and I hated Nurse Leatheren's Narration, It needed Hastings and Thank Goodness ITV put him in it.
I think Murder In Mesopotamia was a good Poirot adaptation, MUCH better than the previous, Evil Under the Sun, but Mesopotamia could have been so much better. At this point the series was getting pretty stale and the thought of adding Capt. Hastings wasn't needed if the script was spruced up better. I didn't care for the Vera Rossakoff subplot, for the attention they put into that, better care and detail should have been placed on characterization, such as Nurse Leatheran for example, which in the adaptation she's merely there.
"The Clocks", "Third Girl" and "Hickory Dickory Dock" aren't great, but they don't make the list because I enjoyed reading(most of) them nonetheless. "The Hollow" is boring, but I can't honestly say it's bad.
We've argued this before (MiM is one of my favorites). I wonder whether one of the reasons you don't like this book is that so many characters are based on real people, so that they don't really feel true in the book. For me, in addition to enjoying the book (and I liked Amy Leathern as a narrator, much more than the pastor in "Body in the Library), I found the parallels to the real life people (especially as presented in her autobiography) absorbing: According to AC and Max Mallowan, Louise is Katherine Woolley (read about her here: http://bjrichards.blogspot.com/2013/01/more-deadly-than-male-life-of-katharine_4954.html), Leidner is Leonard Woolley, Emmet is Max Mallowan, the religious father is probably based on one that AC met in Ur, and... Nurse Leathern is a spoof of AC herself! I have to say that if this last is true, AC had a tremendous sense of humor and an ability to laugh at herself.
you might be right Tali, It might be that I prefer Fictitious people to real People and that people need to be Characatured to make them enjoyable for me as when a Character is based on a Real person they are charactures of those people and As Agatha Found love on that Experdition it was too close for her and so she didn't Characturise them enough for me, I loved The Parson in "Body In The Library", I really enjoyed his narration aswell as the Book.
I put not liking the Book down to the fact I found The Plot very boring too aswell as The Characters and Nurse Leatheren's Narration.
...I put not liking the Book down to the fact I found The Plot very boring too as well as The Characters and Nurse Leatheren's Narration.
I agree - the plot is not convincing, neither the marriage of Leidner and Louise nor the murder. Nurse Leathern I really like - she reminds me of a nurse who was a great friend of my mother, and she comes alive for me. Also Carey, Coleman and Emmett, and Dr. Reilly. The others are kind of cardboard characters - even Miss Johnson is rather a stereotype. But The Leidner-Louise-Carey situation rings true.
This was long before "MeToo" and women's empowerment. So the idea of a woman using her sex appeal as a power tool made a lot of sense - and a lot of tragedy as well.
Comments
These are ones I would put on The List
For me, the worst Poirot novel is easily Elephants Can Remember. Christie rambled a lot in Third Girl and in Halloween Party as well - overly long descriptive passages that really didn't add much value overall in my opinion. For that matter, having read and reread Christie multiple times over the years, I have come to the conclusion that out of her phenomenal body of work, there are only three true duds - Elephants Can Remember, Passenger to Frankfurt and Postern of Fate.
Murder In Mesopotamia, It was slow and Boring and I hated Nurse Leatheren's Narration, It needed Hastings and Thank Goodness ITV put him in it.
http://bjrichards.blogspot.com/2013/01/more-deadly-than-male-life-of-katharine_4954.html), Leidner is Leonard Woolley, Emmet is Max Mallowan, the religious father is probably based on one that AC met in Ur, and... Nurse Leathern is a spoof of AC herself! I have to say that if this last is true, AC had a tremendous sense of humor and an ability to laugh at herself.
I put not liking the Book down to the fact I found The Plot very boring too aswell as The Characters and Nurse Leatheren's Narration.