Started Murder At The Vicarage

Ariadne

I was surprised by two things. First, how Miss Marple sat around at tea and gossiped with the other elderly ladies. I didn't picture her as a gossip. I know she talks with people to gather clues, and listens, or I guess you could say, snoops. But I pictured her as a nice, elderly lady who wouldn't join in with the old gossips in the parish. Maybe I'm wrong. The last Marple I read was A Murder Is Announced and she didn't seem that way in that book, but as I say, maybe I'm wrong. The second thing that surprised me was the vicar's dislike of her, and how both he and his wife called her "an old cat" or some such name. I only thought some of the inspectors in her books didn't like her very much simply because she could solve things that they couldn't. I don't know, I was just surprised. What are the thoughts of others here? Thanks.

Christopher_Wren

Murder at the Vicarage was Miss Marple's first book, and she was much more gossipy in it than in the later ones, which were written more than a decade later.

Tommy_A_Jones

Miss Marple isan elderly lady who does what elderly ladies do, like drink Tea and sit and chat about goings on and she is an observer of life aswell as taking part in the Community, these days like then she would help at the Bring and Buy's, Jumble Sale's help arrange Fete's, she wuld probably be a member of the Female form of the Lions these days, It had never occurred to me to question the way the Vicar and Grizelda refer to her, anyway I have always preferred the Harmon's in A Murder Is Announced and Sanctuary.

Karencos

I don't think they disliked her really. It was the vicars wife who called her an old cat, not the vicar. He had some respect for her.

mike1410

You need to read The Thirteen Problems, which are actually Miss Marple's first appearances in print (from 1927) and as such precede TMATV  (1930) even though when collected in book form they were published later (1932). In those stories we are introduced to several characters who feature throughout the remaining Miss Marple books; Dolly & Col Bantry, Sir Henry Clithering, Raymond West & wife.

Between The Thirteen Problems and TMATV, the character and physical description of Miss Marple does change, she is softened somewhat by AC and made a little younger and more pink and fluffy than she is originally described. Perhaps AC didn't want to repeat the same mistake she made with Hercule with regards to age (isn't he about 115 years old by the time of Curtain?), or just wanted to give Miss Marple more public appeal.

By the way, the term 'old pussy' would not have been as derogatory then, as it may seem to be today. Merely a fairly accurate term to describe the type of elderly lady many of her readers would instantly recognise. And like any old pussy, Miss Marple relies on local gossip for information gathering, that's one of the reasons she knows so much about village life. Indeed, there's a line in A Murder Is Announced where Miss Marple and Dora Bunner are talking in the village tea rooms, when Miss Blacklok arrives with the words " Coffee and gossip?" If Miss Marple had been the type of person who kept herself to herself, she would have been burnt at the stake as a witch when all her deductions were proved true!

madeleine.lapworth

My mother bought me this book and I think it was the first I read age 10 -12
So it has a special place in my heart and remains a comforting favourite

Tommy_A_Jones

Has it occurred to anyone else that making Miss Marple was an Afterthought? I think Leonard could havebeen the sleuth?

Kristy Bryson

Oh, I don't think she was an afterthought to this novel at all. In fact, quite the opposite, as evidenced by the maps and schematics included by the vicar. The location of her garden on the path was key, not only to her being a key witness, but also being used as a witness to support the alibis of the murdering team. As for Leonard, she's used the young amateur sleuth as a bit part in other books before. There were school age boys in 4:50 From Paddington. They are almost a nod to her fans.

Tommy_A_Jones

I had not taken into account Miss Marple being used as a Sleuth or the Map I just focussed on the fact that I think The one of the men went to another of the men's Houses (I think) but I take your points and Loved The Book As For the young Amateur sleuth in 4.50 From Paddington, I don't think he really was he was just a device to find a Clue.

Kristy Bryson

You know, I think I confused your previous comment. My apologies! You said Leonard (the Vicar), but in my mind I was thinking Dennis (the Vicar's nephew). I still believe that Marple was invaluable to the solution, but I do agree that Leonard had found himself determined to figure out the mystery and couldn't quite understand why this little old lady succeeded in besting him at every turn around. For that reason he served well as a kind of foil to better appreciate what she managed to deduce with what every one else considered limited physical access to clues. Love it!

Tommy_A_Jones

I sometimes get Rev Clement and Rev Harmon muddled up and quite often thing the first name of the one in Murder At The Vicarage is Clement as in Freud so don't worry., I love both books, I think Reverent Clement makes a good Side-kick but I think I prefer Bunch To Grizelda.

taliavishay-arbel

I think that the fact that we hear the vicar's voice as narrator makes the difference - after all, he is a very vague and indeterminate character, and his wife loves to shock - so her expressed view of Miss Marple may well not be her true opinion. While I prefer the third person writing for Miss Marple (I found the first person by Miss Marple problematic, because she has to "blow her own horn"), I think in this case it adds a dimension which has to be taken into account. in other books, Miss Marple says that she can ask questions because people expect an old lady to like gossip, so it is her "tool of the trade".

Tommy_A_Jones

I am confused I thought Third person in MM books was only used in The Audio Cassettes where Miss Marple is played by June Whitfield, I do wish in a way The Adaptations had had the Vicar telling The Story I think that would have been Good.

Griselda

Miss Marple has often said that Victorians always thought the worst of people - and were usually right. (I think in Dumb Witness And The Moving Finger etc) She said, that for this reason, they were never shocked. Ina Carribean Mystery (or Murder), I think Miss Marple even comments that people in her young day, didn't talk about s-x, but enjoyed it more, and it was called sin then! I think in 'Murder At The Vicarage' there is the clash of generations, Griselda is not wanting to think the worst of people, and so believing the elderly ladies are being terribly catty, when, to Miss Marple, they are just being realistic - although, probably not always saying, in so many words, exactly what they are thinking - which makes them seem underhand. 

Tommy_A_Jones

Grizelda seems a woman before her time and in Caribbean Mystery there is a bit where Miss Marple and the Vicar's Sister obey the Vicar like there teaching has told them. Mr Pye In The Moving Finger is wonderful

Griselda

Yes, I remember that episode! Those two were also very gossipy and above being shocked. The vicar was such an important lynchpin of society in pre-war times.

Tommy_A_Jones

The Pompossity of that bit made me laugh, I sometimes think of our local Church and am reminded always of The bit in the Hickson Adaptation of Murder At The Vicarage, I would love to go to a sermon just to see the Middle0aged ladies with their hats but I suppose that is not the right idea, I haven't been for 30 years but I feel I am there when watching the Hickson Episode.